Saving Orangutans. Leif Cocks, Part 2

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This is part two with Leif Cocks.

Saving the orangutans.

Leif Cocks began his career with the Perth zoo in Perth, Australia, where he met, observed and interacted with many of the animals.

Through his zoological journey he discovered orangutans and their intelligence.

He has several academic qualifications as a zoologist and biologist.

His research is peer reviewed.

He has worked and continues to work with species management programs worldwide while continuing campaigning and lobbying for animal welfare in the wild, including the

He is dedicated to habitat protection.

Leif has a passion and he says it best.

My work with the zoo had instilled within me an iron clad determination to make a practical and lasting difference for all orangutans and other beings on the planet.

I am so honored and so thrilled to bring Leif Cocks and his positive imprints to you.

Leif, welcome to the show.

Thank you.

It's wonderful to be here..

Oh, thank you.

I'm excited.

You're bringing a wealth of knowledge not just knowledge, but research.

You started so young with your journey.

I've working with 15 orangutans, as you mentioned, and then discovered not only that, they're wonderful beings, but the self-aware persons

that don't belong in captivity.

In fact, they don't do well in captivity and they can only thrive while living in their own culture and communities in the wild.

And of course at the same time, discovering that they're critically endangered species being driven to extinction by having them individually slaughtered on a mass scale.

And, and therefore that started on my journey to, save the orangutans, but not only in doing that, helping save other living beings, such as tigers, elephants, indigenous human communities.

And of course, protecting the habitat is one of the most effective things we can do to mitigate climate

change.

Change.

What we're seeing is every civilization, from south America or the Mesopotamia, it's actually fallen down through ecological destruction of its immediate environment, ; agriculture

We're seeing it and we're doing this on a global scale and we're just following the same traditional pattern, watching our civilization slowly reach the limits of this

And we're going to collapse in on itself, but we have the opportunity one for a better word, spiritual and moral evolution.

So we have as human beings, this capacity, to come out of that tribal framework, we have this opportunity now.

So, we all should just give it our best shot.

An orangutan lived during world war II.

She suffered from post traumatic stress syndrome.

P.T.S.D.

Yeah.

Mawas.

Yeah.

So that's one of the things that goes into orangutan rehabilitation.

You have to repair their poor little minds.

As we know with human beings, we cannot learn, socialize properly and become independent unless our minds are in good, healthy condition.

And if you've seen your mother killed and eaten in front of you, you can imagine for that poor baby orangutan is the most horrific destruction of their little minds you can experience.

Mawas is a classic example of how persons suffer and how mental trauma can affect them

their entire life.

Mawas was Sultan of Johor's, personal pet, in Johor state just across the Strait into Singapore, which was heavily bombed and taken by the Japanese in in WWII.

And so she got bombed during this period.

was taking Atjeh and Puan to start the colony and found Mawas in the personal garden of the Sultan of Johor sitting in a cage.

So ask to take her too., but she'd been traumatized.

And so I was looking after her until she died.

She was oldest orangutan to have lived when she died.

But one of the tragic things is they started this Australia day sky show where they basically had planes flying around and then, boom, boom, boom,

And so every Australia day I would spend the night sitting with her and, , and keeping her calm and giving her that love and support to get her through the whole literary, reliving the bombings and WWII.

I think that story just lets us know that the, the level of suffering poor orangutans go through, even when they do survive and how that trauma just like in human beings can last an entire lifetime.

And I hope in some ways that story instills a level of compassion and understanding.

One of the sayings that comes to mind is, God forgive them, they know not what they do; people killing and eating animals

Destroying the rainforest.

If they only could feel like it's a fraction of the suffering, they're causing that they would just be so aborrhent, you know, about their own actions,

yeah.

Well, that was an incredible story.

Mawas incredible story.

You took that time to stay with her, during that the Australian, I guess it's a celebration of sorts, but with

the the 4th of July in America at the same time.

Okay.

and the fear.

I agree with you that higher intelligence is there within the orangutan and so many other animals that we haven't done enough observations on.

There are just so many stories about the different orangutans that you have had a relationship with.

There are so many stories, it's been a lifetime of spending time with these wonderful beings.

It's been a privilege, I've been an Orangutang mother, which is obviously an unusual thing for a middle-aged man to say, but, so it's been a wonderful, and it's been one long, strange trip its been and the experience.

One of the ones that I talk about in my book, which I think often, people, when they're reading a book, tell me they cry at this particular, this story.

I had to go find a new male for my female I had like 10 females.

And they need the new, a new male because all the males were their sons to breed with.

I used to be a small population biologist.

And so we found two orangutans in America, which should be a match for my females.

So I went to look with one of these research centers, these horrible research centers.

And at the time, for example, they were getting chimpanzees to smoke crack to see the effect , of crack on the babies.

And so that kind of stuff, and normally wouldn't let a person like me in, but they had this male orangutan there that was the perfect match and they didn't want to have orangutans anymore.

So I went into this and saw it.

And next door, there was another orangutan that came out of its concrete Hubble.

And I couldn't tell when it moved towards me, whether it was dragging its feet or walking, cause it was so fat and it started sign language to me.

And I, I asked the keeper there.

I said, oh, what's he saying?

He said, oh, we don't know.

We don't speak sign language he's Chantek the sign language experiment from the seventies.

, we've got no idea.

He just signs to us and so I actually found out what he was signing.

He was signing "get the keys, let's go."

And so he was trying to communicate to, to help me get out of here.

And coincidentally, I did it in my own small way.

I was staying at a Zookeeper's house because when I travel, I normally stay at people's houses.

or stay in the zookeeper house at Atlanta zoo and I said, oh, look, I found Chantek the famous sign language orangutan.

I'm going to ring up my director back at the zoo and say, look, I'll grab the other orangutan but can I grab him too?

I know we can't breed from him, but we can save him from this.

So the keeper said, oh, look, Leif has found Chantek.

No way the Australians going to take that orangutan nationalism coming in, but so he did ring up the center.

"I want the orangutan."

And he basically got taken to Atlanta zoo.

It's still in captivity, but well, you know, light years of increased welfare and Lyn Miles the, the lady who originally trained him and taught him back at the university, got to connect with him again.

She wasn't allowed into the research center.

And so w it was, uh, not ultimately the happy fairytale ending that we hope that all orangutans can go back to sanctuaries or in the wild, but it certainly

To get them out of there.

Leif answered a call to protect and free orangutans through The Orangutan Project.

Yeah.

We funnel that money and we have the strategic plan, which everyone can download from our website of what we're going to do and how we're going to do it.

Save the eight ecosystems of the right type, shape, and size of rainforest to bring orangutans, each species and subspecies orangutan through the extinction crisis, as well as the elephants and the tigers.

We've got to have separate projects for them to bring them under the umbrella of orangutan conservation.

How we work with indigenous communities, not only these ecosystems, environmentally self-sustainable but economically self-sustainable.

So the indigenous communities can prosper and live in harmony with with the rainforest and all that is being then working with a multitude of wonderful organizations and individuals.

Again, it is selfless collectivization.

We work with all these wonderful organizations with advice and technology and points appointed with money and forming joint companies and foundations to work together to save the ecosystems.

So working together globally to bring in the funds necessary to make that meaningful change, working with wonderful individuals and organizations on the ground to then

Well, such a commendable organization, I have researched it.

You are top notch organization on the, star list.

It's a list that helps people know what organizations are out there to give to that are actually putting the money in the field.

We have a moral obligation, especially in developed countries because part of our wealth and affluence, it is vicariously by that fact that living in the society is we're borrowing from the future.

And then we'll be consuming the capacity to support people into the future.

And we're also destroying people's environment in developing nations in order that people who live in these affluent environments in developed nations are buying from the future.

And so we have a moral obligation to give back.

But for many of us, it's not easy.

We're not experts, in particular fields; we don't maybe have the management skills to collectivize it, et cetera.

At least we can all give a little bit of money, give a little support or become a volunteer and raise money.

So we all have the capacity to make our lives more balanced, you know?

And and give back to the planet and other people as much as that we're taking.

If I lived out there, I would be one of the volunteers helping out in any way I can.

So let's look at your books because they are full of stories and, just the power of your words is inspiring.

Now, one of the books did, you know, it's $2,000.

Oh no!

Is it?, there's some error on the book site, is it?

I don't know, but it's the orangutans and their battle for survival is $2,000 on Amazon.

It's

out of print.

It's out of print and somebody bought one decided to cash in.

Yeah.

Yeah, they did.

So, but wow, that, that would be an interesting book.

So I hope it can go into reprint.

I don't know how that works with publishers, but you have finding our humanity and you have Orangutan's my cousins, my friends.

And that's your journey.

Yeah.

I mean, a couple of things about the books is there's no author royalties or anything.

I've never made a cent book in my life, even though, Orangutan my cousin, my friends has been an Amazon bestseller.

If you do buy the paper back, it's, it's environmentally friendly inks and, and recycled paper.

And then, so they're the all in some sense autobiographies about my life.

And so, yeah, and and then the last one is finding our humanity and that's really is come out of when, finishing ...my cousins, my friends I really felt that I had still more to say

and in essence, more to give.

All the money goes to helping save the orangutans and the ecosystems, but also it helps the reader.

It's the positive effect on, on the reader and their journey to happiness.

And, and so it's, it is about everything that we do in the orangutan project including, these books, it's about a win-win situation of giving; in this case, giving some information, stories, and

Well, I'm not finished with it just yet, but I am so much enjoying Orangutans My Cousins, My Friends, I have both finding our humanity and the other.

And even though it's autobiographical on your life, it has so much history of the orangutans in it.

And some of your research, which I think is really important, as well.

There's not many books out there about orangutans.

There's more on the gorillas and the chimps.

Yeah, no, exactly.

I mean, in general, we often see Africa as a bastion of conservation and wildlife because that's how we're brought up, with Africa on a Saturday afternoons.

But the wildlife in Asia is far more endangered than Africa, and there's beautiful persons.

Beautiful, great apes and close relatives in Asian rainforest.

African conservation is important.

But it's so much more dire in, in Asia and therefore the need to, for us to concentrate efforts on Asia.

One of the stories I put in, I think was finding our humanity is, the little girl on the beach and millions of starfish washed on the beach and she's throwing them back.

And a cynical man says, , you can't can't save 'em all..

Well it matters to each she throws back.

And that's the beauty of it.

We, again, as we get into false paradigms.

It's the individual welfare of the animal, no, it's the whole environment and the individual doesn't matter.

No.

Get off these false paradigms.

Both matter.

We don't know the outcome.

And you're not going to know the outcome.

You're not going to be here to know the outcome

exactly.

But we have that vision and that vision is based on science and sound understanding.

And our own individual selves are rewarded.

A life of selfless service.

I am so thankful that you did not get discouraged with all of your planning and still being bombarded with all of the atrocities that continue to happen.

And so we need people like you to continue work, but continue the inspiration and bringing the information and the science.

Your research is science and evidence-based and peer reviewed.

And that is so imperative to education.

Moving forward with the protection of any species is understanding them, the true them through science.

Thank you.

All right.

So let listeners know where to find you, you have couple of websites.

Yes.

We, we have the, the orangutan project all one word, you come see us on a website.

We have Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter.

And of course we also, because a couple of species are falling outside of our umbrella of concern because elephants and people are killing each other and tigers had criminal syndicates coming in to poach them.

So we started up the international elephant international tiger project to bring all species.

And then yet you can come come on the website and see all the work that we're doing to protect the forest and work with indigenous communities.

As things open up post COVID come to the rainforest with me and experience the beautiful beings, with the orangutans firsthand,

I would love to take my husband out there and go out with you just because not just to see the orangutans, but to go out with an icon

of preserving this species.

And that would be an incredible journey for me.

a lot of people come and have life-changing experience.

And I give talks every night and kind of campfire talks on the, on the boat, on the river and take people in journey.

And of course you get to meet the wonderful young Indonesian conservationists who are on the front line, and then so it's, it's a very genuine enriching experience.

And for many people it is life-changing.

Oh,

absolutely.

And for me just doing the research on you has been life-changing for me.

, it is life-changing for me and the things that you've said today, very life-changing and things that I want to do better myself . The Orangutang project.org and it is the, with the word, the.

Theorangutan project.org.

Orangutang is O R A N G U T A N and he also has one regarding his books and a little bit more information about him.

LEIFCOCKS.ORG.

That's L E I F C O C K S.org.

You've been extremely inspiring, but what are your last inspiring words you'd like to share?

Yeah, I mean, I'm just maybe paraphrasing is yeah.

Love all and do what you please, because if you love all, your actions will in sense be beneficial and care to others.

So there's a great freedom in love and universal love.

I hope everybody can experience that joy which is inherent in all of us.

Destruction or the sacrifice of individuals it is always wrong.

That's not how nature works.

The compassionate love of all living beings individually and collectively always bring the best and most notable outcome for all.

The individual orangutans that we save and give the opportunity to live a free and happy life is a lifetime achievement of immeasurable value.

Leif Cocks..

Thank you so much.

You're you're truly humble, but yet you are very vocal in what the message is that you want to get out to citizens of the world regarding your studies with

Leif Cocks.

Thank you so very much for sharing your positive imprints.

Well, thank you Catherine.

Thank you everybody.

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